Lucifer.... who or what is he to you....????

[Annette]

Is he the dawn of the morning.... the sun before the sun... is he actually Satan, a fallen Babylonian king or was he the most beautiful fallen angel who teamed up with Satan after a fall out with God???



Discuss.......

[Leo-Gonzo Satanist]

A symbol of inner enlightenment.

[Revanchist]

There is no passage in the bible that connects the names "Lucifer" and "Satan". Not one. They do not mean the same thing.

[Revanchist]

When priests use the names Satan and Lucifer interchangeably, it only goes to show their ignorant assumptions and lack of religious education on the matter, especially if they are "certified" priests spreading their word to the masses. I hate calling their asses out on that shit. The Bible is where the names Satan (adversary) and Lucifer (light-bringer) come from. Even if you do not believe in the Bible, is there a source before the bible that uses those names? This is why I cannot restrict myself to any one particular denomination or religion, because they all have flaws, even Satanism.

[Wickedpa]

I believe Satan is a thought form.

[Hunniedust]

I have to say this has been a question on my mind. What I have found is the first Luciferian worship was from the Romans which worshiped the morning star then called Lucifer an now the same star is called Venus. Later I have found I believe it was before the inquisitions that there where xians using the title of Luciferian an the Pope said it was a group of satan so as not to lose people. I do find Lucifer to symbolize light or being inlightened but do not find where Lucifer an Satan are truely one in the same. That is only how I see it I am not nessarly right or wrong jus my oppinion. If anyone can show me otherwise please do.

An jus because Satan an Lucifer are refered to as one does not make it so. Much of todays beliefs came a couple even a few hundred years into "CE" So to me he represents jus that a bringer of light or enlightenment. I have a site jus to toss around this topic it has been as I said a question burning deep within..... lol Ok tired going to bed I hope I made some sense.

[Whippet]

i see lucifer as the most pure and intelligent angel but i like to percieve Satan as the Demon type .i see beauty in both but i like the idea of the hardcore Satan because my mind has always been wrapped around that sort of vision of my life and peoples true nature.

[Annette]

I certainly do not believe Satan and Lucifer are one in the same. As I never did believe and argued many times to Xians that the Father son and the holy ghost are NOT one in the same... They are all SEPARATE entities or what have you.

My take is more or less Jesus is to God as Lucifer is to Satan and I dont mean as Lucifer is the son of Satan but just his right hand man...so to speak...someone once gave this answer to The Satan and Lucifer theory....


Satan and Lucifer are two different beings all together. Satan is a demon of animal instincts, everything humans are without the christian views applied to life, Satan is.

Lucifer is an angel, he is knowledge, he holds little power, but the knowledge he possesses makes him just as useful as Satan in some aspects which is why he is still used.

And my answer to that was:

If Lucifer is knowledge and knowledge is power wouldnt that make Lucifer "powerful" as well?

[Prince Beelzebub]

I don't believe they were different, but after more research I found that they are really 2 different names for the same entity or aspects of the same entity or force. Lucifer means light bringer and Satan means adversary. Both these descriptions apply to the entity/force/archetype we Luciferians or Satanists seek connection with are the same entity. I can even prove it to you all.

If you google the first real unholy bible written by a evil monk way back in the BC century before christ. You will see that I am right. The very oldest unholy bible the book is a huge ass book 4' by 5' feet big and one foot thick and is in a museum it some country some where but I don't remember where.

I even seen about this on the history channel about a few months ago.

Even if you search the google for the very first unholy bible ever written long before christ you should be able to find it. Trust me this book is real. I have seen it my self on T.V.

Anyway,

The names Lucifer and Satan in later Hebrew and in Christian beliefs, the supreme spirit of evil, who for immeasurable time has ruled over a kingdom of evil spirits and is in constant opposition against jehovah for the mass murders that he caused. The word Lucifer and Satan is derived, via the ecclesiastical Latin word diabolus, from the Greek word diabolos, an adjective meaning ‘'slanderous,” used also in ancient Greek as a noun to identify a person as a slanderer. The term was used in the Greek translation of the Bible, the Septuagint, not to refer to human beings, but rather to translate the Hebrew ha-satan (“the satan”), an expression originally used as the title of a member of the divine court who functioned as jehovah's roving spy, gathering intelligence about human beings from his travels on earth. Because aspects of this heavenly figure were probably drawn from experience with agents of ancient Middle Eastern royal secret services, it is not surprising that the word "SATAN" should also be seen as a character who attempts to provoke punishable sedition where he finds none, thus acting as an adversary for jehovah and the human beings on earth, bent on separating them from jehovah due to Satan seeing jehovah killing the people of the earth and Satan rebelling against jehovah for the mass killings and genocide by flood, plague and famine ect. In all speculation about Satan, the major problem being addressed is that of the origin and nature of EVIL, (q.v.).
Minding you that Satan rebelling against jehovah was because he did not see killing innocent people of the earth just because they deified jehovah and Satan ask the other ark angels of heaven to join him in his fight against jehovah's mass genocide murders and most of them did. Even tho they new they were out numbered 10 to 6 against jehovh's top arch angel Michael. However the rest of the angel's who turned against jehovah
for the slayings are the one's we now know today by names like. Satan and hells army listed respectfully in order below.

Abaddon : Hebrew root meaning "to destroy", same as Apollyon
Apollyon (Abaddon) : The King of Demons Rev 9:11
Abigor : Christian demonology - commands 60 legions
Adramelech: Arch Demon whose name means, "King of Fire"
Agares : First Duke of the East, commands 31 legions; appears willingly
Alocer : Strong Duke commands 36 legions; lion's face, dressed as a knight on a horse
Amduscius : Great Duke, governs 29 legions; looks like a unicorn
Andras : Marquesse, commands 30 legions; bird head with angel-like wings
Asmoday : Prince of demons; thought to be the serpent that deceived Eve
Asmodeus : Demon of wrath, banished by Raphael in the Book of Tobit 8:3
Astaroth : Strong Duke over 40 legions and the treasurer of hell
Aym : Great Duke, who commands 26 legions; from christian demonology
Ayperos : Prince, commands 36 legions; from christian demonoly
Azazel : Chief of the goat-demons or "hairy demons"
Bael : Head of the Infernal Armies of 66 legions
Balam : Terrible king with three heads and commands 40 legions
Beelzebub : Prince of Demons, aka Lord of the Flies, former highest ranking angel in heaven
Belial : Chief of all devils, brings about wickedness and guilt
Belphegor : Demon or "god" of the Moabites, Numbers 25
Berith : Great Duke of hell who governs 26 legions, appears as a red soldier on a red horse
Bifrons : declares the understanding of geometry, astrology and other arts
Botis : Appears as a viper, and proclaims the past and future
Buer : President of hell, of the second order, and commands 50 legions
Caym : Great President who takes the shape of a thrush; rules 30 legions
Charon : The boat man who brings souls across the river Styx
Cresil : Demon of impurity and laziness
Crocell : Grand Duke who appears as an angel, and governs 48 legions
Deumos : Female demon with 4 horns and a crown
Eurynome : Superior demon who feeds on corpses; the Prince of Death
Focalor : Grand Duke who drowns men and overthrows ships of war
Furfur : Count of hell, commands 26 legions; appears as angel with a flaming tail
Gaap : Prince of hell, intensifies love and hatred; transporter demon
Geryon : Giant centaur, guardian of hell
Haures : Strong Duke of hell, commands 20 legions and is very frightful with eye aflame
Ipos : Demon count of hell who commands 36 legions; looks like a lion-headed angel
Jezebeth : Demon of falsehoods and lies
Kasdeya : From the "Book of Enoch", the 5th Satan
Kobal : Demon of hilarity
Leonard : Master of black magic and sorcery
Leviathan : Dragon of the Sea, the Crooked Serpent of the abyss
Lilith : Demon of waste.
Lucifer : Light bearer, son of the morning; former seraphim cast out of heaven
Malphas : Grand president of hell, commands 40 legions; appears as a raven
Mammon : Demon of avarice
Mastema : Leader of fallen angels whose job is to tempt men to sin and accuse them before God
Melchom : Demon who carries the money purse; payer of servants
Mephistopheles : Another name for the devil in the Middle Ages
Merihim : Dark Prince of pestilence
Moloch : Demon worshipped by the Israelites through child sacrifice
Mullin : Demon lieutenant of the demon Leonard
Murmur : Great Duke, comes with trumpets sounding and rules 30 legions
Naberius : Strong demon in charge of 29 legions, a Marquis of hell
Nergal : Second order demon, commands the secret police
Nicor : Water demon known for drowning humans; can cause hurricanes, tempests and the like
Nybbas : Manager of visions and dreams, inferior order charlatan
Nysrogh : Second order demon, chief of the house of princes
Oriax : Marquis, demon who commands 30 legions; teaches astrology
Ornias : name of the harassing demon
Ose : Great President, governs 30 legions
Paymon : a king of hell, master of ceremonies; governs 200 legions
Philatanus : Demon who assists Belial in sodomy and pedophile behaviors
Proserpine : aka Persephone, princess of hell
Pruflas : head of 26 legions, has the head of an owl; provokes wars and quarrels
Pyro : Prince of falsehoods and lies
Raum : Count or Great Earle, commands 30 legions; seen as a crow
Rimmon : aka Damas, an ambassador from hell
Ronove : Marquis of hell, commanding 19 legions, teaches languages
Ronwe : Inferior demon, commands 19 legions
Samael : demon angel of death, prince of the power of the air
Semiazas : Chief demon of fallen angels
Shax : Duke of hell, commanding 30 legions, deceitful thief; appears as a stork
Shalbriri : Demon of blindness
Sonneillon : Demon of hatred
Stolas : High prince of hell, commanding 26 legions; teacher of astronomy and plant properties
Succorbenoth : Chief eunuch, sexless, demon of gates
Thamuz : Ambassador of hell, demon master of big weapons
Ukobach : Inferior demon who maintains the fires of hell; appears ablaze
Uphir : Demon physician
Uvall : Duke, commanding 36 legions, knows the past, present and future; strong and scary
Valafar : Strong Duke, commands 10 legions, appears in the shape of a lion
Vepar : Grand Duke, strong; guide of waters, like a mermaid
Verdelet : Master of ceremonies
Verin : Demon of impatience
Vetis : Demon of corruption
Xaphan : Second order demon, former fallen angel, fans the furnace flames
Zagan : Demon King, deceitful, commands 33 legions
Zepar : Grand Duke, appears as a soldier, commanding 26 legions
Zeal, : Demon of toxic air and brim stone of flames
And many, many more joined Satan in the fight against jehovah!.

In later Jewish tradition, and thus also in early Christians thought, the title becomes a proper name; Satan begins to be seen as an adversary not only to jews and Christian beings but also—and even primarily—of jehovah. This development is probably a result of the influence of Persian dualistic philosophy, with its opposing powers of good (Ormazd) and evil (Ahriman). But in both Jewish and Christian systems, the dualism is always provisional or temporary, the devil being ultimately subject to jehovah. In the writings of the Qumran sect the devil AKA Satan emerges as Belial, the Spirit of Wickedness against Jews and Christian but that's what Jewish tradition and Christian thought of Lucifer, Satan in witch are the same demon.

In some strains of rabbinic thought, Satan is linked with the “evil impulse to fight jehovah for the genocide agenst man kind,” which is thus personified to some degree. This personification is a Jewish form of the widespread and ancient assumption that human beings can be subjected to malevolent forces distinct from their conscious minds. Thus, both in Judaism and in Christianity the belief is found that human beings can be “possessed” by the devil or by his subordinates, the demons. Only a true follower of Satan will never be attacked by any of Satan and Satan's underworld demons.
Since it is an unholy war against jehovah and christianity and their beliefs only. Satanist will never be harmed by “possession or possesed” by demons. Satan sees christianity and Jews as a evil foe and Satan and his subordinates, the demons will only possess and attack people who are Jews and christians. This has been proven time and time again and history even proves this to us.

Perhaps the core of Satan teaching about jehovah and about the Christians is that Jesus Christ tried to brake the grip he and jehovah and his Jewish people faced by demons have on the whole of Jewish humanity (the “possession” of some is a symptom of the general domination of all Jewish and christians alike ), and that in the crucifixion the devil AKA Satan and his henchmen, working their worst on all Jewish and christians, were doomed, paradoxically, to ultimate defeat by jehovah. Also known as paradise lost due to jehovah and due to jehovah we as people and Satanist must suffer due to jehovah as a sick genocide mass murder that he is and will always be!...

In the Middle Ages the devil played important roles in art and in folklore, being almost always seen as an evil, impulsive animal-human with a tail and horns, sometimes accompanied by subordinate devils. The thought that the latter could take up residence in human beings served more frequently to differentiate the possessed from the normal than to indicate something about the state of all humanity in the world today as we see it.

The complexity, mystery, and corporate nature of evil have caused some thinkers to believe that a place must be found for the devil even in modern thought. J.L.Ma., J. LOUIS MARTYN, M.A., Ph.D.

See also DEMON,; SATANISM, in my future blog on my page.

For further information on this topic, see my Bibliography blog on Angels and demons in my Joe blog profile.

[Revanchist]

Annette- I kind of feel like Lucifer is to Satan as Jesus is to God; I have to admit, you made me think on that one. Still, there is no pre-biblical or biblical passage that links the two so it would merely be a creative assumption on our parts.

[Annette]

Quite frankly I agree with it being a creative assumption.... BUT on the other hand.... I dont care what the BIBLE says or doesnt say... lol no offense of course.

[Hunniedust]

I don't even concider the bible as a valid source, however even if it were valid there is nothing in it to validate Satan an Lucifer as being one. So many things I read as assumptions xians to attempt presenting the book as saying or meaning more that it actualy does, it is like they quote a part of the bible an use the name Lucifer an I am wondering where they get that, they jus add it an the sheep run with it ........ Just more grass for the sheep.

Untill I find more I jus have not found the "history" to back it up. As I said earlier historicly there were Luciferians during the Roman times that worshiped the morning star now called venus an so on but I see Lucifurry has done an awesome job of adding additional research

[Lucifurry:352]

Well, according to several sources "Lucifer" is a mistranslation of certain misunderstood things:

(Wiki): "The phrase "O Day Star, son of Dawn" in the New Revised Standard Version translation given above corresponds to the Hebrew phrase "הילל בן־שׁחר" (Helel Ben-Shachar) in verse 12, meaning "morning star, son of dawn". As the Latin poets personified the Morning Star and the Dawn (Aurora), as well as the Sun and the Moon and other heavenly bodies, so in Canaanite mythology Morning Star and Dawn were pictured as two deities, the former being the son of the latter.[10]

In the Latin Vulgate, Jerome translated "הילל בן־שׁחר" (morning star, son of dawn) as "lucifer qui mane oriebaris" (morning star that used to rise early).[11] Already, as early as the Christian writers Tertullian and Origen,[9] the whole passage had come to be applied to Satan. Satan began to be referred to as "Lucifer" (Morning Star), and finally the word "Lucifer" was treated as a proper name. The use of the word "Lucifer" in the 1611 King James Version instead of a word such as "Daystar" ensured its continued popularity among English speakers.

Most modern English versions (including the NIV, NRSV, NASB, NJB and ESV) render the Hebrew word as "day star", "morning star" or something similar, and never as "Lucifer", a word that in English is now very rarely used in the sense of the original word in Hebrew (Morning Star), though in Latin "Lucifer" was a literal translation." - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

"Anyway, by A.D. 405 Jerome had completed his work, which we today know as "The Latin Vulgate" Bible. It is far from an infallibly accurate translation of the original texts. Rather, it is an interpretation of thought put into idiomatic, graceful Latin! For a thousand years this Translation was without a rival--and herein lies the problem!" - http://www.israelofgod.org/lucifer.htm

So if we take a closer look at the word "Shahar" (which means morning/day star in Hebrew) to which the mistranslated Latin "Lucifer" was associated with we come to find out that this Shahar is an old Canaanite god.

Shahar/Shachar was the god of the Dawn, while his twin brother Salim/Salamana was god of the Dusk. The Goddess Asherah was their mother and the god El (later known as Elohim or Jehovah of the Torah & Tanakh) was their father. - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canaanite_religion & http://canaanitepath.com/inner_sanctuary.htm & http://www.dhushara.com/book/god/canaan.htm

So within its original cultural matrix, the "Morning Star" Shahar (which the Egyptians knew as Shaqara) was one of many gods common to Semitic peoples, which had nothing to do with "Satan" at all because the Hebrews did not yet become a Monotheistic people yet. That comes later after El (Elohim/YHVH) is made the One and Only God after being influenced by Zoroastrianism.

The original word "satan" also was not evil or associated with a "god" per se:

"The name satan, satan (satan 2252a) - and the feminine form Sitnah: Sitnah - come from the verb satan (satan 2252) to resist or be an adversary and is used six times in the Bible (Psalm 38:20: '...they satan me because good follows me.')
The noun satan (satan 2252a) is used much more frequently, and only a few of these occurrences denote the big bad guy:
1 Ki 11:14, "And YHWH raised up satan to Solomon; Hadad the Edomite..."
1 Ki 11:23, "And Elohim raised up satan to him; Rezon son of Eliadah..."
In Numbers we even see this noun ascribed to the Angel of YHWH:
Numb 22:22, "...and the Angel of YHWH set Himself in the road as satan..." " - http://www.abarim-publications.com/Meaning/satan.html

Originally, in it's ancestral cultural matrix, the word "satan" just mean anything that caused your to resist God or anything that hindered one's faith in God. Sometimes in the Bible (in its original Hebrew) God himself is a satan to his people. God's angels can be satans. One's own impulses and cravings are satans. Many things can be satans, which is why in the Quran (in Arabic) satan is plural as "The Satans" which implies and suggests that originally there is not just one "begin" named "Satan" at all.