Does Satanism need a "Nicene Creed"

[Leon Engelbrecht]

One of the "nice" things in hristianity is that most have a simple half-page statement that sums up the essentials of the faith.The early church adopted the Nicene Creed in the 4thC CE (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicene_Creed) as a way, very effective I may add) of expresing belief.

It may be useful for us to have something similar. Anyone agree?

[Serpentine]

The Satanic Bible lists the Nine Satanic Statements, The Nine Satanic Sins, and the Eleven Rules of the Earth. Those I would say are the creeds by which LaVeyan satanists live by. Others find relevance as well. I'm positive that drawing us all underneath one umbrella would be an epic failure.

[Leo-Gonzo Satanist]

I'm of the mind that once you have embraced the essentials that Serpentine listed, the rest is up to the individual. For instance I usually throw Crowley's Liber Oz on that list but that's me.
However you're going to find people who carry the title "Satanist" who don't even adhere to the aforementioned and there is nothing that really can be done about that. However to the point, Serp nailed pretty much the Modern Satanist's guideline.

[NARCISSUS]

Most certainly there are those who try to make a satanic nicene creed, but that's only idealistic as there are different "denominations". I would say there can be something that "unifies" satanists and that would be freedom, knowing thyself and creating a reactive change. More importantly I would also add to that evolution/progression of the individual into more than what they are.

[SugaCubez 352]

One must think of the wyrdfull consequences of defining limits and establishing such psychological territorial landmarks. If you consider the convenient half page of creeds Christianity made circa ~312ish AD, one would see that such an established creed acts like an city wall, and that for the past 1700 years, Christianity has remained stagnant and has not evolved, or even kept up with the progression and gradual mental evolution of humanity, or even human spiritual needs. What creeds and simple beliefs of a person with the brain and worldview of a peasant of 300AD might not satisfy the mind and spiritual needs of the mind of a 21st century person. Having such a wall also automatically creates heretical institutions, in that anything that exists outside those established landmarks in not "true" Christianity. Meaning that any attempt for the memeplex of Christianity to change, grow, evolve, or progress into something new and better is rejected. Stagnant memeplexes are a detriment to the psychological wellbeing of an individual and produces mental deterioration and psychosis after a while. One has to only study your average Christian today to figure the side affects of a stagnant memeplex.

The Church of Satan and its 9 Statements, and such do the same thing: it puts up a wall and prevents progression from happening, and automatically creates heathen satanic doctrines and such that any satanic group which does not fall within the established landmarks is not considered "genuine" satanism, or as the Church of Satan calls them: "Pseudo-Satanists." All you have to do is observe the state the Church of Satan is in today to actually see the negative affects such limitations has. Today there are more "freestyle" do-iit-yourself Satanists - mostly of the traditional and Theistic kind - then there are dogmatic LaVeyan Satanists. This is because unlike these doctrines with defined limits and creeds, the human brain is actually progressive by nature and grows in capacity over time, thus as time passes it needs new and more better/evolved things to stimulate its further growth.

The end consequence of setting such defined creeds/limits is memetic death. Christianity is dying in the Occident/West, especially places like Europe and Australia, as these people have become progressively scientifiic enough to understand that such creeds are childish myths. Christianity is growing now in Asia and Africa (third world countries) in which most of the people have not yet been exposed to science and are still very superstitious.

The Church of Satan is also on its last days, not so because it has crazy doctrines, but because it has limited itself and the people have progressed and moved on (evolved) since the 1960's. The Zeitgeist and Weltanschauung of the average person of the 21st century is far beyond that of the person from 1960. This is the same concept of using 1960's software in a modern desk top computer - altho the software may work, there are better current ones out there, and such old biological software could in fact do more harm to your system, such that your system is limited or devolved or deteriorated to submodern conditions.

Is this what you want for Satanism? To place a death warrant on it? Have you not learned from the past, from studying the Christian and LaVeyan memeplexes?

I would say that "Satanism" needs to be open and and undefined, so that each individual Satanist can see what they want to see in it, use it as the need it, and evolve it according to their own needs and personal progression. That way, Satanism as a memeplex grows with the small group of people that gives it life. I only state this second option because the ONA is like this. ONA has no walls around its city, no limits to what it can and ought to become. Like a growing person, all ONA has that is concrete and tangible is its past. Its future, like the future of all people, is a misty sea of infinite possibilities, wherein each Initiate of the ONA moves ONA forward, and evolves it toward that misty future, as they themselves grow and move forward. ONA has been around since the 60's also, but with the passing of each decade it changes shape and form so that the ONA in any point of time frame is never truly the same. In the same way that a living person, is never truly the same individual today, as he may have been 5 years ago. A Living Entity grows and evolves like this. This is the difference between a Living Memeplex, and one that is doomed.

If you truly care about your Satanism, you need to let it out of its defined cage to be wild and feral - to be free to become, evolve, into its own thing. Otherwise it will die. Look around you at the Satanic scene currently. Satanism is dies and getting old bbecause of these restrictions, restraints, defined creeds, and city walls. There is no room from growth; and the 21st century mind, has out grown 1960's weltanscauungs. If humanity is to further evolve into the future, it must need to reach for that future, and let go of the past. These defined limits are an anchor which mentally, psychologically, and spiritually holds one down. All it takes is a simple thought experiment. Just take a Laveyan Satanist of say 1970 and compare it to a LaVeyan Satanist of 2009 and ask yourself honestly if: during the 20 years that past between these two people, if Levayan Satanism managed to manufacture/create new peoples to keep up with progression of time, or doe it just make the same old models decade after decade with the same basic 9 belief? The same closemindedness of anything that transgresses those 9 basic beliefs? Then ask yourself what kind of person, Human, actually needs what is the essence and totality of Life, Existence, and Reality, to be reduced down to nine bite sized pieces that only fills half a page?The thing about reductionistic simplifications and thinking as this is that, over time, the Believer or Reductionist begins to actually believes to be true, and actually subconsciously rejects everything else which do not fit into such reductionistic constructs. If "Satanism" is to be a successful memeples (an I doubt it will ever be due to the kinds of minds that populate it) it must keep up with the progression of Life, and it must be a reflection of Life: feral, without limits, in which everything is possible.

[Leo-Gonzo Satanist]

I agree that the Church of Satan in it's efforts to keep the concept within it's own parameters is suffocating it. I speaking for myself practice and encourage fellow "Mods" to use LaVey's constructs only as a jumping off point.That is to say once you connect to the basics, it is up to the individual to run with the ball in which ever direction one may choose. Satanism should never be a pigeonhole for one to get stuck in but rather a tool for liberation of mind and spirit.

[Leon Engelbrecht]

excellent responses!
thanks!
any more?

[Leo-Gonzo Satanist]

Do yourself a favor, having gone through countless books on Satanism, stick to The Satanic Bible, The 11 Rules.., 9 Satanic Sins, 9 Satanic Statements, Liber Oz (Crowley) and you'll be fine. Build your own tradition on these foundations and you'll be good to go. 99% of the crap out there is just that, CRAP! I'm sitting a few feet away from so much wasted pulp on the matter. Save your money and time.

[Leon Engelbrecht]

lol
i hear u

[Mister_Six]

Satanism has more holes than swiss cheese, so yeah, it definitely needs something to keep it a sound philosophy and keep their members in line. The higher ups of the CoS are satanic parrots, and just regurgitate things they've read, instead of actually applying it to their lives. I think that many of the followers use satanism as a "I can be a dick cuz I wanna" card, just so they don't get called on their behavior. Whether you like it or not, we are all accountable to those around us, your piss poor attitude may be responsible for someone else's negative attitude towards you. Push someone far enough and you will understand. Also along with an un-healthy impoverished ego we also have to take into account that they tend to take out their inadequecies on those around them with little or no concern for others. Along with the endless pissing contests and staking claim, they have nourished a parasite. A parasite that consumes, while giving nothing back to it's host. There are sooooo many things wrong with satanism because of it's followers, not necessarily because of the philosophy.

Satanism NEEDS ethics, and morals, and they are there. You just have to look. I feel bad for people that have to rely on being ambivalent due to fear of being "less satanic".

[Leo-Gonzo Satanist]

The "holes" in Satanism are the ones you the individual fill in. There are ethics in Satanism for all the world to see. The most important thing one must bring to Satanism or any path for that matter is ballance. You must have a knack for walking that Middle Pillar if you're going to make any "ism" work for you.

[Leon Engelbrecht]

Balance: Please expand on that thought if you'd be so kind.

[Leo-Gonzo Satanist]

Satanism can shift too far to one side if not put into balance. For instance people in the past have run with the concept of indulgence without the balancing factor of personal responsibility. Satanists have been accused of "being a dick" as suggested by Six. Unfortunately this is true more often than not. In this case, being a "dick" should only be deployed when called for to those who deserve it. Until then, civility should be the rule.Satanism with it's emphasis on vital existence can be over materialistic. This is where a Satanist can bring in balance on their own by practicing such things as meditation and least keeping the door open to certain spiritual concepts. In my case I'm a fan of the Tao te Ching. Keep an open mind.....but not so much that your brains fall out of the back of your head.
To the point, Use your inner compass. You will know when you are tipping too far in one direction. Remember Satanism is a tool not the rule.